rochdale afc /rochdale hornets

a certain mr simon gauge states.

he has tried to get investment in to the club for the last fourteen months

he has been subsidising the club in loans to the value of £ 556k

a investor needs to be in place  by the end of march or the club faces liquidation.

he also says the club is rich in assets but poor in cash.

i think you all can guess .whats coming next

.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2024/feb/20/rochdale-afc-face-threat-of-liquidation-football

He also says uneconomical lease has been one factor that has stopped potential purchasers buying the club….nudge nudge wink wink.

He suggests Rochdale council will help get a new owner relief from this burden.

I can think of one lease he might be referring to.  
 

Through the actions of Rochdale FC board it might be not only one professional sports club whose future is threatened.

I said that we faced losing prefessional sport in the borough if people thought it was preferable to see Dale relegated to non league.   The regular on here who said we should dance on their grave.   Well here it is . . . they survived through the money through the football pyramid - a loss of £1m a year now they are non league.  Without an owner they can't cover the cost.   They have been clear that the stadium costs half a million pounds each year to maintain.   They haven't got the cash now.  I hope Kingsway is ready soon because we might need it.  The town doesn't deserve it - but then the town doesn't support either club to deserve it too.  A ruddy sad day and hope that some enjoy dancing on the grave.  It won't help the rest of us. 

“The upcoming (Dale) Fans’ Forum is taking place on Thursday 29th February, in conjunction with the Dale Trust. Chairman Simon Gauge, members of the Board of Directors, and Head Coach Jimmy McNulty, will all be in attendance once again to answer questions from supporters. The event will take place in the Ratcliffe Bar at the Crown Oil Arena and is free to attend.   Doors open at 7pm with the forum getting underway at 7.30pm.  If you can’t attend but would still like a question asking, please email it to the Dale Trust on info@daletrust.co.uk.  The forum will be streamed live via the club’s (Dale’s) YouTube channel.”

https://www.youtube.com/@officiallydale/featured

Dale’s Forum:/5 pages!   https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/football/rochdale/forum/306562/egm-+-statement/#107

For those wondering about the reference of ‘Kingsway” above:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjs-Lm4z7yEAxUGXEEAHXadBkUQFnoECA8QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hornetsrugbyleague.co.uk%2Farticle%2F1208%2Fcommunity-club-launch-plus-facilities-redevelopment-plans&usg=AOvVaw1fwcSvs5UXj3fXVTmNkApc&opi=89978449

I expect the forum will be cancelled, as they have been in the past given its only one week before the EGM.  If it were to go ahead it could get quite heated given fans anger and the belligerence of some of the directors.

There’s a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth over on the football site. It appears that the new chairman isn’t the Messiah most of them thought he was after all. When I used to go on their site I said there was something about the guy that just didn’t ring true to me. This was when he first got involved with the football club. It was obvious that the relationship with Hornets, that had finally got onto an even keel after years of animosity, wasn’t to his liking and he was going to do something about it. 

On 22/02/2024 at 12:39, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

There’s a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth over on the football site. It appears that the new chairman isn’t the Messiah most of them thought he was after all. When I used to go on their site I said there was something about the guy that just didn’t ring true to me. This was when he first got involved with the football club. It was obvious that the relationship with Hornets, that had finally got onto an even keel after years of animosity, wasn’t to his liking and he was going to do something about it. 

Ironically...it seems back on keel once again

1 hour ago, Athleticgrounds said:

Ironically...it seems back on keel once again

I’ll reserve judgement.

Have we got the trophy cabinet back then?

On 25/02/2024 at 00:30, Anita Bath said:

Have we got the trophy cabinet back then?

It went in 1923 when we had to return the Challenge Cup.

Looks like another attempt to explain why they are the only club playing at Spotland. How can they claim to be the only pro club in the borough. Hunters sting that the numpty major gets involved for football but not rugby league. 
 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2024/feb/28/rochdale-fight-to-survive-ratcliffe-liquidation?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

Should say “ nteredting that the numpty major” ….Fat fingers strike again

says in a blog this morning that a american is interested in buying rochdale afc .

and several other parties are interested.

american  morning 

Under the awful name of world ‘soccer’ .  Clearly they wont give a toss about ‘rugger’.

4 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

Under the awful name of world ‘soccer’ .  Clearly they wont give a toss about ‘rugger’.

They will have to give a toss.  Who knows - they might buy both clubs and take on the SuperLeague.    Better than liquidation and an empty stadium - or houses.  

According to Mr Gauge one of the terms for purchasing the club was getting rid of uneconomic leases.

I dont think our current owner will roll over and play dead in the same way Mr Gauge has done.

10 hours ago, HornetsGrey said:

They will have to give a toss.  Who knows - they might buy both clubs and take on the SuperLeague.    Better than liquidation and an empty stadium - or houses.  

Read the statement with interest and it looks positive.

As the new owner has shown at Oldham embracing the Rugby League club and paving the way for both of the towns professional sports clubs to work collaboratively from the same facility, gains the full support of the local council leadership and politicians. There can be absolutely no doubt that TOGETHER is always stronger, an outfit that seems to have multi club interest should hopefully understand the value of bigger picture thinking and you would imagine want/ need the whole town onboard with a new vision. 

It would seem that relationships are in a much better place now between respective clubs with our Chairman and General Manager (a Dale fan) both regularly showing public support for Dale in recent times.

Hopefully the new RAFC ownership will see the value in both clubs to the town and its communities as a whole and respect the lease agreement that's in place. It can never be forgotten that Hornets lease was a mutually beneficial agreement with Hornets getting an affordable lease in return for RAFC acquiring full ownership of the ground, an asset that will undoubtably make such a take over and investment far more attractive and dare I say viable.

Working together is common sense, the bigger both get the more revenue the stadium generates.

Good luck to them getting it concluded and starving off the threat of the alterative which would appear to be almost certain liquation.

12 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

According to Mr Gauge one of the terms for purchasing the club was getting rid of uneconomic leases.

I dont think our current owner will roll over and play dead in the same way Mr Gauge has done.

He didn't say that.    He made comments that uneconomic leases was a problem in Dale trying to break even when the club announced it needed an investor.   I watched the Dale fans forum last night and no mention was made of Hornets or any conditions around the ground except to say that the Dale Board want the ground to be used for sport and never wanted liquidation as an option.   They have lost hundreds of thousands each by bank rolling the football club this season and liquidation of the club would have given them more chance of getting their cash back as a liquidator would have sold the ground.   They didn't do that because they want professional sport in the borough to survive.   They were season ticket holders before and said they will be happy to be back on the terraces after the deal goes through.   There was no negative comments at all.  I know it doesn't suit your negative style, but I am relieved and pleased that somebody is prepared to invest in our sporting clubs and venue for the benefit of the community that support their sides week in week out on the terraces.  

52 minutes ago, HornetsGrey said:

He didn't say that.    He made comments that uneconomic leases was a problem in Dale trying to break even when the club announced it needed an investor.   I watched the Dale fans forum last night and no mention was made of Hornets or any conditions around the ground except to say that the Dale Board want the ground to be used for sport and never wanted liquidation as an option.   They have lost hundreds of thousands each by bank rolling the football club this season and liquidation of the club would have given them more chance of getting their cash back as a liquidator would have sold the ground.   They didn't do that because they want professional sport in the borough to survive.   They were season ticket holders before and said they will be happy to be back on the terraces after the deal goes through.   There was no negative comments at all.  I know it doesn't suit your negative style, but I am relieved and pleased that somebody is prepared to invest in our sporting clubs and venue for the benefit of the community that support their sides week in week out on the terraces.  

In terms of uneconomical leases i am not sure if that was with reference to Hornets or not as im not sure how many lease holders are based at the stadium.

What i am sure of however is Hornets lease can never be looked at or referenced without a full knowledge and the facts of how it was negotiated and ultimately created. It should never be overlooked that RAFC obtained full ownership of the stadium (presumably the main attraction and primary asset in any investment process or sale) for less money, and Hornets were given a lease which all parties at the time knew was less than it would have been if the discount on the price of the stadium had not existed.

Therefore over the lifetime of the lease, and including the discount on the capital payment for the stadium, Hornets IS in fact an economic lease and not uneconomical. This is a key point for a new owner / investor , that it is economic and im sure everyone involved in both clubs are fully aware of this fact.

If Hornets are successful it will only drive increased revenue through the stadium and the town will only benefit from having two professional sports clubs being on the up and doing great things in the community. Fingers crossed this deal goes through and we can all kick on.

20 hours ago, HornyHornyHorneeet said:

In terms of uneconomical leases i am not sure if that was with reference to Hornets or not as im not sure how many lease holders are based at the stadium.

What i am sure of however is Hornets lease can never be looked at or referenced without a full knowledge and the facts of how it was negotiated and ultimately created. It should never be overlooked that RAFC obtained full ownership of the stadium (presumably the main attraction and primary asset in any investment process or sale) for less money, and Hornets were given a lease which all parties at the time knew was less than it would have been if the discount on the price of the stadium had not existed.

Therefore over the lifetime of the lease, and including the discount on the capital payment for the stadium, Hornets IS in fact an economic lease and not uneconomical. This is a key point for a new owner / investor , that it is economic and im sure everyone involved in both clubs are fully aware of this fact.

If Hornets are successful it will only drive increased revenue through the stadium and the town will only benefit from having two professional sports clubs being on the up and doing great things in the community. Fingers crossed this deal goes through and we can all kick on.

I agree with your analysis of the lease and the ‘discount’ but that was then and this is now (or will be after next Thursdays EGM). Following the vote the new owners will take full control of the stadium. I would hope there would follow an early announcement of how they see the relationship with Hornets moving forward.

Its also great that at the administration level there seems to be an improved relationship between the two clubs. But in the interests of transparency has that led to the restoration of facilities at the stadium. I am thinking of the display/trophy cabinet and office accommodation and club shop.

2 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

I agree with your analysis of the lease and the ‘discount’ but that was then and this is now (or will be after next Thursdays EGM). Following the vote the new owners will take full control of the stadium. I would hope there would follow an early announcement of how they see the relationship with Hornets moving forward.

Its also great that at the administration level there seems to be an improved relationship between the two clubs. But in the interests of transparency has that led to the restoration of facilities at the stadium. I am thinking of the display/trophy cabinet and office accommodation and club shop.

I understand your point and concern to some degree but legally binding contacts / lease's do not work that way. Im sure when our current ownership took on Hornets contracts and agreements existed that they deemed uneconomical and would have gladly done away with, but a company regardless of take over or ownership is duty bound legally and morally to honour its agreements and liabilities.

Hornets are lease holders and have an agreement at the stadium therefore regardless of whoever owns the club that agreement should not change.

The only way it would change and we all need to start to worry is if the proposed take over doesn't go ahead. If RAFC are liquidated and as HornetsGrey has alluded to we are all likely knackered.

and the facilities…..have they been restored? Or were they not covered by the lease?

11 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

and the facilities…..have they been restored? Or were they not covered by the lease?

Well it’s clear we no longer have the offices or the shop space we once had but we do seem to be making the best of things with pop up shops on match days etc.

Most crucial one for me has been a return to 3pm kick offs as 1pm was no use nor ornament.

Also it seems full stands are in use for games that demand it. Halifax was a full stand for a crowd over 1000 and the now cancelled Law Cap had allocated over 1000 tickets and was set to be a full stand.

It has been good to see increased Hornets branding / signage on match days in reception etc, albeit temporary and also the Ratcliffe bar being opened for games with a crowd that demands it. 

Since the arrival of Matt Rigby the game days have significantly improved in my opinion and there seems to be a big effort and focus on the game day experience with each home game this year having a theme and event of some kind wrapped around it.

The bit that’s under our control as fans is to turn up and support to help grow numbers as ultimately both clubs benefit.

All five motions passed so all systems go for the US ownership.

Bully boy Gauge threatened to call off Saturdays Dale game if the motions werent passed. Went on to insult shareholders who voted against motions.

He is a lovely lad…for a southener.